Does Taylor deserve a fair deal?

Benton Bob wrote...

This is just more sensationalism. If I was Steven Taylors Dad I wouldn't be making comments like he has to the press.For the last 2-3 years ST has been playing alongside Boumsong,Bramble, Moore,Carr,Babayaro,Ramage Huntington etc. To be honest you wouldn't have to be brilliant to stand out amongst that lot, and to be fair ST has looked better than any of those mentioned.NUFC have had a poor defence for over 40 years (Craig, Anderson, McGrath, Iley & Clark was the best). Big Sam has come in and for the 1st time ST faces some real competition for his place. I think most supporters do like ST but are circumspect about the finished product. It's up to him to prove himself to BS over the next season or 2 that he's good enough for our club and if he does, a new improved contract will inevitably follow. Apart from Lee Clark (at Fulham) the other guys mentioned -- Watson, Elliott & Thompson didn't really improve after they left us.The comment about him being miles behind Milner and Zog in the £ stakes is quite hard to undertstand.I would like to understand what "miles" actually represents.You would have thought 21 year olds who have been at the club a few years & are all in the 1st team at present, would be treated in a similar fashion. However you can't compare to the likes of Luque and Boumsong -- big money signings with automatic big pay packets -- thats life. If I was ST & saw what was happening at SJP, I would knuckle down, make it hard for Sam to leave him out, try & break into the England squad, then after all that, batter down Sams door for a new Contract.He'll still be only 22-23 at that point.

Posted by: Benton Bob  | September 7, 2007 12:35 PM

hadrian wrote...

his fathers comments make me cringe , the players who he mentions in the same sentance as the lad , you would think tayls was all grown up and been in the england squad for years . he was cover due to the lack of depth in our defence , and you can already tell big sam doesnt like having any players so young with to much responsibility , tayls is back on the bench this season id say and being brought on or into the starting 11 where needs be and for experience , like any other lad his age .
i would probably argue he should be on similar wages to milner and zoggy , but my earlier points hold true for them aswell .

Posted by: hadrian  | September 7, 2007 1:12 PM

Ray Mossom wrote...

Another case of the club treating it's homegrown youngsters like dirt. There have been so many in the past. Taylor should be on at least the same money as Milner & NZogbia and maybe more. I believe if he came up for sale the top 4 clubs would be fighting for his signature

Posted by: Ray Mossom  | September 7, 2007 1:33 PM

Snapper wrote...

without knowing the financial ramifications its difficult to make comment, but having worked at the training ground I got to know Steven and his father Alf reasonably well, and rarely have I met a more balanced pair, Alf an ex policeman works on his son's behalf, and Steven lives and breathes United. I just hope that the club are not being frivilous over this important matter, what vibes does it send out to other young wannabees?

Posted by: Snapper  | September 7, 2007 2:01 PM

Paul Hopper wrote...

If the figures were made public, i am sure this deal would not be far behind Milner and N'Zogbia. As far as I'm concerned this could be a case of him and his family using the "i'm a geordie" card to get a few extra thousand pounds a week. I have to say making these comments are not a very good for his PR. It is understood he is roughly on ten thousand pounds a week now. I am certain the club will have given him a rise. I'm guessing around twenty thousand a week? So what do we know? He is 21. Lets say he has 12 more years in the top flight? that means he'd earn 1.04 million a year for 12 years?! That is 12.48 million for 12 years work!? And how much work? Roughly 60 games a year plus training. 720 games over 12 years for 12.48 million pounds (plus sponsorship etc and this is not taking into account if he were to be offered a contract in 5 years time when he is in his mid-twentys what rise he'd get then!) Not a bad deal! I think this is a case of a young player with one England call up (lets all remember Steve Howey got four caps) and a very big ego being exceptionally greedy.

Posted by: Paul Hopper  | September 7, 2007 2:25 PM

carl wrote...

Benton Bob you are spot on!
ST although good, I fear is in danger of believing his own hype. Im not one of the fans who think he is going to be the next John Terry. I think he is going to be a good defender in time but he has proved upto now that he is quite rash in a lot that he does and makes poor decisions. these things will improve in time and this is when his wages should improve. Ab Faye is getting £30k a week. He has proved his worth, now why should a 21 year old has has untill now been part of a shambolic defence ( not all his fault ) be put on par with him?

Posted by: carl  | September 7, 2007 2:25 PM

Peter Hirst wrote...

I believe that ST is probably worth the same money as the zog and milner. But for his old man to come out in the press and say what he has is out of order. ST should stick in and make it hard for BS to drop him, but on this seasons performance so far he'll be on the bench behind DR and CC.

Posted by: Peter Hirst  | September 7, 2007 3:04 PM

Rob Roy wrote...

I remember reading years ago that Bernard was upset because he wasn't on the same money Titus was. Robson had some funny ideas! The pay structure seems strange at SJP. Look how much Dyer got. Yeah, Taylor's worth as much as Charlie but let's not overegg that local boys stuff. I mean, Robbie Elliott? Nice guy but very average on the pitch.

Posted by: Rob Roy  | September 7, 2007 3:35 PM

Eddy wrote...

Let him go, no one is forcing him out at all. He wont get a place in the first team now and he has lots too learn. It seems he has been learning for ever too.
Potential means nothing in the PL.
You win things with realised potential only.

Posted by: Eddy  | September 7, 2007 4:06 PM

J.A. Forster wrote...

Steven is a very lucky lad to be where he is. Only injuries and circumstances at the club got him into the team, where he has looked very ordinary. The fact that he got into an England squad was unbelievable. I doubt if there would be a rush of Premiership clubs wanting to sign him. His dad should be careful how he handles this.

Posted by: J.A. Forster  | September 7, 2007 5:10 PM

Ray wrote...

When they sell him how much will they pay another club to replace him and how much silly money perweek will they be paying. Shades of Steve WATSON !!

Posted by: Ray  | September 7, 2007 5:57 PM

Paul Patterson wrote...

Now, no player is worth the money they are paid these days, but Im not surprised that this subject has attracted so many posts so soon.

In business sense, losing Dyer and upgrading N’Zogbia and Milner’s contracts even themselves out financially, surely.

But Albert Luque has quietly passed out of the door this week, surely that free’s up more wages for young Taylor, if it’s true he’s being offered a contract that is way below the offers the previous new signee’s have been awarded then they (the club) are really cutting their noses off, Taylor was free to acquire and if we were to go out and buy a Taylor we’d be looking at £10m especially at prices I’ve seen bandied about on players that have moved in the recent window (Look at Zat Knight)

The club need to move here and quickly, thankfully time is on our side with regards his current contract, but lets not leave it too late.

Paul.

Posted by: Paul Patterson  | September 7, 2007 6:55 PM

mark hargrave wrote...

ST has done an amazing job for us, he has been the highlight of a few too many poor seasons. he puts everything into every game,unlike a few too many of the so called stars we have out there. he deserves at least what milner and the rest of the young lads are EARNING. he`s going to be a top player in a few seasons, so stop messing him around, pay him what he deserves and try and hold on to a good english player for a change!

Posted by: mark hargrave  | September 7, 2007 8:05 PM

Len Charles wrote...

Taylor camp need a reality check. Would Ericson take £2M + Taylor for Micah Richards? I think not.If Richards was a Newcastle player would BS make him an offer he couldn't refuse? I think so.

Posted by: Len Charles  | September 7, 2007 8:23 PM

Andrew Davis wrote...

Hi Lee,

I think Newcastle United should be ashamed of themselves as Steven Taylor would walk over broken glass to play for newcastle and i have just heard the news and i am flabbergasted.

Chris Mort you are a joke mate.

Andrew

Posted by: Andrew Davis  | September 7, 2007 9:37 PM

key wrote...

steven taylor deserves parity with milner and n'zogbia. he is not the finished product i agree but he's got as good a chance as any of his age. he lacks a little composure but that comes with age and experience. most importantly he has a desire greater than most at the club. i am dissapointed his dad didn't keep his comments to himself but taylor, for me, has played his way into the milner/n'zogbia pay bracket.

Posted by: key  | September 8, 2007 8:58 AM

Steve K wrote...

I agree with most of the comments on here. Taylor is very much one for the future, and has learnt a great deal from his first team experience over the last couple of years. However, his pretty basic ballwatching mistake for Mido's goal the other week proves he is far from the finished article.

With CC (surely the first choice centre back), DR and AF in the squad as centre backs, Taylor will have spells in and out of the team this season. Big Sam certainly won't risk burning him out as other managers would, and overall this will bode well for his future- not least allowing him to probably prolong his career (and related earnings) by a couple of years.

Taylor and his Dad should accept this and realise the lucky and privileged position he is in. If he wants, I'd be more than happy to swap his talent and career for my current jobhunting situation? If it isn't about money, but "the principle" then that sounds to me like it's all about the ego more than anything. I'd like to think not. Offer him the same terms as Zog and Milner (which he deserves) and if he refuses that, let him stew for a year before the next offer.

Posted by: Steve K  | September 8, 2007 11:38 AM

Jamie Mullen wrote...

do you guys even watch the same games that i do. ST puts everything that he has into every game that he plays. If newcastle had a full back four of Steven Taylors, i would be over the moon. Wages shouldn't be decided over ones ability to play, but by the effort that they put into their game. Steven Taylor is going to be an amazing defender, like it or not. i for one would rather he was stopping goals for us rather that stopping goals against us. A local lad deserves nothing more than local support. If anyone deserves the rediculous amount of money that footballers get. It simply is Steven Taylor!!!!

Posted by: Jamie Mullen  | September 8, 2007 12:45 PM

Steve Maynard wrote...

Newcastle United need to pony up the cash for Steven Taylor. Should he be among the top earners at the club? Of course not. But he's a quality player for the Toon and should be able to become even better in the years to come. We need to respect that and pay him accordingly to keep him in the side. I would hate to see him leave over something like this and become a great player for one of our rivals.

Posted by: Steve Maynard  | September 8, 2007 8:12 PM

Bendy wrote...

I think there are two elements that the Newcastle Board need to look at in regards to Taylor's new contract offer, first does he want to play for Newcastle? Well I don't think any Newcastle fan will disagree when I say that he wears his heart on his sleeve, remember the likes of john Anderson and Glenn Roeder, not technically gifted but true 100% er's and the second thing is the cost of replacing Taylor if he left - will to be honest I don't think there is another centre half out there who will give their all like Taylor does. His dad has raised the issue because he thinks the offer is derogatory, he is right I think give him equal terms to the Zog and Milner and let him show his appreciation with many more years in a black and white shirt on Tyneside

Posted by: Bendy  | September 9, 2007 9:31 AM

will emm wrote...

Have we been watching the same side? Steven Taylor is captain worthy, one of the best defenders England will have in the future. He really WILL be the next John Terry.

Posted by: will emm  | September 9, 2007 11:31 AM

adam wrote...

It all seems to be about "principle", I think calling it greed is rather harsh. At the end of the day he hasnt been offered as much as Milner and N'zogbia and he should be.

Whilst he is obviously still being paid a large sum can you imagine going to work and all your colleagues get a pay rise except you.

I know I wouldnt be very happy.

Posted by: adam  | September 9, 2007 3:22 PM

MauritiuanTooni_inLA wrote...

Consider the post from the BBC dated Sunday, 2 January, 2005, 10:36 GMT

"Magpies complete Boumsong signing of Jean-Alain Boumsong. Boumsong joined Rangers on a free transfer in the summer. Newcastle have completed the signing of Rangers defender Jean-Alain Boumsong for a fee of around £8m. The 25-year-old French international has signed a five-and-a-half-year deal."

Jean-Alain Boumsong's paypacket was estimated at pounds 35,000 per week.

If NUFC could drop 35K for JAB they could do better for a future England regular.

Posted by: MauritiuanTooni_inLA  | September 9, 2007 6:00 PM

Ross wrote...

If anyone can pay more than £30 grand a weeks to someone who was consistently in the team making mistakes week in-week out, then how can someone who is in the squad and makes some of the "senior" players look silly not be on par?

Yes, it is true that ST is still young, but you don't become the captain of the Englan U21's for just having potential, Tayls is far more mature than his age when he steps onto a pitch.

BS will realise that ST is worth more than what he is getting, it's just a case of trying to convince the people who run the club what a defender is and that they should be paid that much to employ him...................

Posted by: Ross  | September 9, 2007 7:44 PM

phil matues wrote...

Guys,Guys...Get Real !!!!Do you know anything about business?..He will get the deal he wants,but its about negotiating.The fact that he has 2 years left on his contract and talks have started already tells you that.So stop all this whining!!!!!!!!!!!

Posted by: phil matues  | September 10, 2007 11:28 AM

Mr Toon wrote...

If Taylor wasn't a 'Geordie' or he played for another club, would the majority of Toon fans still think he was the best defender since Bobby Moore? He's a local kid who tries very hard but is still raw and makes many errors and would probably be a fringe player at most of the top clubs. His dad's comparisons are funny - Boumsong and Luque admittedly were flops but were seasoned pros as is Geremi and most of the current buys this season. Gerrard and Carragher have achieved much and are far better players. Then, Milner is a similar age but has far more experience although I do agree that he should probably earn similar to Nzogbia. I've get the feeling that local adulation and his U21 captaincy has gone to his and his dad's heads. Running through brick walls for your local club doesn't mean you deserve big money!

Posted by: Mr Toon  | September 10, 2007 12:48 PM

richard wrote...

I said when i first saw stevie T that this boy will be the newcastle united captain and a fyrture england captain i still stick to these statments. Big Sam needs to get ST onto a long contract that pays him the money he derserves. we cannot let a local lad and a very good centre half leave our club.

Posted by: richard  | September 10, 2007 1:09 PM

Vin wrote...

I think the lads's biggest problem is his Dad. He is not doing his son any favours by blabbing to the press. This will only antagonise the club and the fans.

Posted by: Vin  | September 10, 2007 1:32 PM

Paul Patterson wrote...

Mr Toon, Why bring the Geordie subject into the equation? Just look at the facts, We’ve saved money on Solano, Dyer, Luque, Bernard, Bramble etc, most of which hardly played a game as were always injured.

There was nothing professional about the way Boumsong and Luque went about their business while on Tyneside, so if swapping their wages for Taylor was the only way of keeping Taylor here, then go for it (That would mean Taylor should be on £120k a week if you believe what them two were on and that would be scandalous)

Stevie Taylor only wants parity with what James Milner and Charles N’Zogbia (Both imports by the way) are on, and, by all accounts he isn’t being offered that.

Taylor has been brought through the ranks and is widely tipped to be Newcastle (And England) Captain one day, he doesn’t get injured and sulk off at the slightest niggle (He got a potentially nasty neck/shoulder injury against Wigan but came back and played on, that would have had a few players we‘ve had over the years out for weeks)

You’ve brought the Geordie Card into it so I’ll use it to proper effect, he plays games, (Carr/Babayaro/Luque/Dyer/Emre) is reliable, doesn’t abuse fans, (Parker) get into trouble, (Various) smash his expensive car on the Tyne Bridge, (Dyer) threaten not to play if he is shoved out to right back, (Dyer, Bellamy) feign injury (Bellamy)

He’s raw and makes mistakes, but he’s 22, John Terry showed promise and nothing else at that age.

We’ve had our fair share of dodgy apples at Newcastle, and if were complaining about Steven Taylor then we really have something to worry about.

He’ll get his contract though I’m betting.

Posted by: Paul Patterson  | September 10, 2007 2:00 PM

Mr Toon wrote...

Paul Patterson: I agree with your comments but virtually all the players you mention are older and more experienced than Taylor which was my original point. As he improves, gets older and more experienced he will more than likely get a more rewarding contract if not before. If he was already on the wages Dyer etc were on, older players coming to the club will want even more - bit of a catch 22.

My Geordie reference is that we Geordies like nothing better than a local lad coming good and rightly so, but we can over hype them. Watson, Clarkie and Elliot spring to mind and there was a lot of discontent when they left but did any of them go on to join bigger and better clubs? Would we have tolerated Shearers contribution in his last couple of seasons if he wasn't a Geordie?

Our club now has an owner and manager who are both very business like, unsentimental when making decisions and money will probably not be wasted like it has been in the past. Under the old regime, Taylor probably would have been offered much more but I feel those days are now gone and he will be rewarded accordingly when the club see fit. Like yourself, I can see him improving and probably being captain one day, but with the crop of experienced defenders recently brought in he might not even get on the team sheet and will have to be content with sitting on the bench.

Posted by: Mr Toon  | September 11, 2007 2:02 PM

Paul Patterson wrote...

Points taken Mr Toon, but Im not really bothered about age, if Taylor is 21 and Bramble, Boumsong et al are 26 but not performing to Taylor standard then Taylor should be at least on parity.

I think it’s actually even more amazing that Steven Taylor shows more leadership and authority than more experienced counterparts.

But the point about imports coming in and their demands is a fair and good one.

On the subject of Shearer’s contribution, in his last few season’s I personally saw nothing wrong with it. 2004/5- 40 games/19 goals, 2005/06- 40 games/15 goals, this coming in a very negative and poor side, compare this to Sibierski and Martins and we have a decent return for a 35 year old.

The sad thing about Elliott and Clark, whilst good to see, they weren’t really very good were they, Clark was sold in 1997 when he was at best a decent squad man, behind Batty, Lee, Beardsley in the pecking order, what do we go and do, re-sign him in 2005, not a good move and Elliott made ricks in his last couple of seasons with us that Sir Titus would have been proud of.

Steve Watson I couldn’t understand why on earth Gullit sold him at the time.

I’ve always advocated bringing on talent like Taylor, but surely in helping him on, playing him week in week out isn’t the answer always.

Instead he needs to be taken out of the side every now and again and others get their chance, finally we have the depth by which to do this after all these years.

Taylor shouldn’t have been a regular at such an age, but because of incompetence from certain pre-mentioned names, he was thrust into the side and stayed there on merit alone.

The first round of talks obviously weren’t to Taylors liking, but the next round (Coming up next week if you believe the media) should be slightly more rewarding.

Paul

Posted by: Paul Patterson  | September 12, 2007 2:25 PM

Craig Colquhoun wrote...

Although the last person to hold a trophy above his head was a Scot and a bloody good one can anyone else tell me when the next Geordie half back other than Steve Taylor can even imagine to be close to Mr Taylor in doing so in the not to distant future speaking purely with total belief by his performances over last and this season
"Come on guys hes worth every penny of the rest of the squad !!!! Give him his dues pleaes before its to late ??

Posted by: Craig Colquhoun  | September 16, 2007 2:04 AM

Billy Heets wrote...

Steven Taylor is over rated.

He makes as many mistakes as Bramble did (which is too many) but this seems to be missed by the majority of Newcastle fans because he is a geordie.

Hopefully, Big Sam has seen that he is a liabilty which is why he will be either 4th choice CB or better still, sold.

Against Alkmaar, he elbowed an opposition player in the head, had he of been sent off (which he should of), we would of been destroyed. Against Birmingham, he had another rush of blood, causing us our worst result in living memory.

The reason Boumsong and Bramble were shipped out, was to lower the wage bill, why oh why would we go down the same route of paying poor centre backs vast sums of money?

Posted by: Billy Heets  | September 16, 2007 11:21 AM